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  1. #26
    DIY Audio Registered Member ron.eddy's Avatar
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    Back to the original post...

    Build your own box, you will be very happy. Listen to whoever you want. Either way you will definately be happy with your system compared to what it is now and you will only have to spend < $200! Which is a good thing, no matter what anyone else thinks! LOL
    Ron

  2. #27
    I'm in your head Registered Member CVStroker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ron.eddy
    I said I did overemphasize the standing waves. I am used to building midrange/treble setups, but it is a rule of thumb for anything above 100Hz...

    All I can tell you guys is that I have had cheap woofers (all I could afford when I was 14) and put them in many different boxes and you WILL notice the difference if you strengthen the box, no matter how much you guys want to argue. All I am saying it, TRY IT if you don't believe me... . If experience doesn't count in this forum then I guess I am out of my element.
    You also have to take into effect the listening environment. A car is about the worst place to try to get perfect SQ, so even though you may notice a difference in sound by overbuilding a bow in your house, I highly doubt you'll notice it in a car, road noise, wind noise, other ambient noises etc will most likely nullify any improvements that you gain by overbuilding the box. My point, I'm not going to argue the improvement, I'm sure it does make it sound better, but in a car environment, it's just not worth it. Space and weight are at a premium in a car, so sometimes you have to go with a situation that is "less that ideal." Anyway, if you want a truely dead box, built it out of concrete (don't laugh, people have done it).

    BTW Easy, you forgot about your 12" Brahma that I've got for the time being.
    Life: It's the ultimate sin; a game with no rules that you're expected to win

  3. #28
    DIY Audio Registered Member ron.eddy's Avatar
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    CV, I agree. Road noise and everything else do make sound quality kind of null, unless you are lucky enough to own a 100,000 dollar lux car of course...

    But my point in ALL of this (and I am sorry if I am getting defensive) is that you WILL get more output at all frequencies with a stronger box. It is a fact of physics. The more constant you keep the internal volume of the sealed box, the more output sound is achieved. You aren't just trapping the backwaves remember... You are KILLING them. Thats the idea. Take it or leave it..

    And yes CV you are definately right that in a car weight is an issue. I can't argue with that. I would never put my shiva box in my car, thats for sure!

    So sorry if all of this twisted anyone the wrong way. I hope everyone learned a thing or two at the very least. I know I did: Low Bass = No Standing Waves

    Sorry about that error.
    Last edited by ron.eddy; 10-07-2004 at 22:04.
    Ron

  4. #29
    Junior Member Registered Member
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    As an Engineer myself, I can certainly appreciate all the theory presented here. But I do have to agree that for my purposes, it probably just doesn't matter. After all, I'm putting this into a Subaru Forester, which is not exactly known for its sound-deadening acoustics.

    I appreciate the responses and it does sound like the 4-channel amp and 10-inch sub would be a great fit if I can get it for less than $200. I saw a few "deals" on eBay that look like it might be possible, but there aren't many used MTX404 amps out there -- the new ones are going for around $150 with shipping on eBay right now.

    That being said, are there any other alternatives for a decent amp other than the MTX404? I've seen some el-cheapo amps for a lot less than $150 out there, but I have a feeling that they're probably junk. But I also know that there can be some good stuff that's cheap, too, especially with electronics. I guess I'm looking for someone with some experience here to guide me.

    Again, thanks for everyone's input. It's been very helpful.

  5. #30
    DIY Audio Registered Member ron.eddy's Avatar
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    Hmm, IF you can find it on eBay, you can get a new Eclipse 4 channel amp (from this model year) for 100 dollars. But they are VERY hard to come by. I was going to go with one, but one never came up for 2 weeks after I lost out on one (it went for 91 and I only bid 87.50!) So i bit the bullet and bought an MTX thunder 684 for 175. But thats a much better amp than the 404, so it seems odd they are 150 on eBay right now... If you have time, just be patient, but if you need bass immediately maybe someone else will have a good idea for an amp.
    Ron

  6. #31
    Junior Member Registered Member
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    Thanks, I'll do some looking. No, I'm not overly anxious to buy at this very minute, but I would like to start doing some research so I can get something before the end of the year.

    As an example of what I was talking about with "cheaper" amps, I see that a brand new Profile AP740 is going for around $75-$90 (less shipping) on eBay at the moment. I've read some good things about Profile amps here on this forum, and the specs look to be much better than the MTX404 amp, so I'm wondering why this wouldn't be a good choice. I'm sure people can give me other examples, without getting into Lanzar, Pyle, and Pyramid, of course.

  7. #32
    DIY Audio Registered Member ron.eddy's Avatar
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    Yea, good point. If the specs back it up, then its a better amp, provided they used the same standards in measuring output power and noise of course. I have never used profile, so i don't know. I guess in that case it is probably a good decision. I am sure someone will post here soon with some ideas. I am kinda new to 4 channel car amps

  8. #33
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    Just browsing through some websites and found a Cerwin-Vega HED-10SVC sub for $45. I have heard C-V products in the past and always found them to have great SQ.

    But I haven't heard much about this particular sub on this board. At $45, it seems like a good deal and the sub has some decent specs, so I'm inclined to go for it.

    So I guess at this point, I'm planning on going with the Profile AP740 amp and the C-V HED-10SVC sub for a total of around $150 without the enclosure, which I'll build myself.

    Does anyone see any flaws in this logic? I hate being uneducated about all this stuff, but everyone's got to start somewhere, right?

  9. #34
    I'm in your head Registered Member CVStroker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DrewV
    Just browsing through some websites and found a Cerwin-Vega HED-10SVC sub for $45. I have heard C-V products in the past and always found them to have great SQ.

    But I haven't heard much about this particular sub on this board. At $45, it seems like a good deal and the sub has some decent specs, so I'm inclined to go for it.

    So I guess at this point, I'm planning on going with the Profile AP740 amp and the C-V HED-10SVC sub for a total of around $150 without the enclosure, which I'll build myself.

    Does anyone see any flaws in this logic? I hate being uneducated about all this stuff, but everyone's got to start somewhere, right?
    The HED (high energy design) series is a decent sub. IMO, on par with the W0. Just be careful with it, it's not a power hungry sub by any means.

    As for that MTX amp, look for the Road Thunder 404, not the Thunder 404, the Thunder version is a fancier, more expensive version than the Road Thunder version. I do know for a fact that you will get rated power out of the MTX, I'm not so sure about the Profile. Then again, even if you aren't getting rated power, it's not much of a problem, because the 404 puts out more power than you really need for that sub, but headroom is nice.

    As for uneducated, no big deal, just hang around here and ask questions, no matter how dumb you think they sound. This is a good forum to learn on because we don't have that many smartasses wasting time and spreading disinformation around here. Plus we got several well educated people who visit the forum regularly.
    Life: It's the ultimate sin; a game with no rules that you're expected to win

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