What Does It Take...

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  • 05-26-2004, 08:56
    mike patton
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Easy E
    Sense his sarcasim guys. HAHAHA!

    Sarcasm? Him? NO WAY!!!

    How's that for sarcasm?

    My initial reply to his comment was something like "Is the sarcasm really necessary?", but then I remembered that the best way to respond to a sarcatic comment like that is to be sarcastic yourself. Then the two sarcasms will effectively cancel each other out...
  • 05-26-2004, 08:58
    mike patton
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Snake Plissken
    Mike,

    Thanks for the reply....I hear you about the box; I guess if I switch to a ported one, I will just have to experiment....my rear seat folds down too, but I just dont like riding around like that.....to me, the car becomes too "ghetto rigged" like that; I have leather seats and all, and like to keep the back seat up....

    Well then, if you have rear speaker I suggest you get rid of them so as to let more bass into the cabin, which will in turn let more bass out of the car. But honestly, if you're looking for good "street bass", a ported box should be your primary concern...
  • 05-26-2004, 09:24
    inteva6184
    that didnt work at all
  • 05-26-2004, 14:45
    Snake Plissken
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mike patton
    Well then, if you have rear speaker I suggest you get rid of them so as to let more bass into the cabin, which will in turn let more bass out of the car. But honestly, if you're looking for good "street bass", a ported box should be your primary concern...

    Thanks man.....you know its funny, my installer friend who put this system in, hung out with me today and we were driving in my car, and again I was complaining about the bass not carrying outside the vehicle, and he yelled as was like "well, you gotta !!!!@$%!@^%! TURN IT UP...." and proceeded to yank my Accord's volume knob and raise the volume display about halfway up on the bar graphics.....we were listening to a hip-hop station on the radio, and to be honest, it STILL sounded not quite like 15" woofers with an 800 watt bridged amp should sound with the power halfway up....granted, my windows were up and maybe the song I had on didnt have that much tactile bass, but his answer was like "well....I told you to go with 12s, not 15s....with 12s, you get that bass that goes through your chest and ****....and moves your hair....15s suck....." and he went on to again defend the whole sealed box thing....he STILL believes sealed boxes can slam and can be heard in the street......I think you may be right about the ported thing, though.
  • 05-26-2004, 20:01
    CVStroker
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Snake Plissken
    Thanks man.....you know its funny, my installer friend who put this system in, hung out with me today and we were driving in my car, and again I was complaining about the bass not carrying outside the vehicle, and he yelled as was like "well, you gotta !!!!@$%!@^%! TURN IT UP...." and proceeded to yank my Accord's volume knob and raise the volume display about halfway up on the bar graphics.....we were listening to a hip-hop station on the radio, and to be honest, it STILL sounded not quite like 15" woofers with an 800 watt bridged amp should sound with the power halfway up....granted, my windows were up and maybe the song I had on didnt have that much tactile bass, but his answer was like "well....I told you to go with 12s, not 15s....with 12s, you get that bass that goes through your chest and ****....and moves your hair....15s suck....." and he went on to again defend the whole sealed box thing....he STILL believes sealed boxes can slam and can be heard in the street......I think you may be right about the ported thing, though.


    Tell him to hang around here for a while. 12's will not hit the deep stuff like 15s will. The deeper the bass, the farther it carries. Ported is about 3 db louder, on average, than sealed.

    Here, give him this site, it will keep him occupied for a LONG time.

    http://www.bcae1.com
  • 05-26-2004, 21:15
    Snake Plissken
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by CVStroker
    Tell him to hang around here for a while. 12's will not hit the deep stuff like 15s will. The deeper the bass, the farther it carries. Ported is about 3 db louder, on average, than sealed.

    Here, give him this site, it will keep him occupied for a LONG time.

    http://www.bcae1.com

    I believe you, and try and argue this with him on an almost daily basis....so, do you believe I should in fact be getting bass that should carry outside the vehicle with 15s?

    What are these SUVs that are tooling around with bass so heavy you can feel it from walking on the street when they pass rolling with if I cant get my TWO 15s to be heard from outside my midsize coupe? What in God's name do they have in there?
  • 05-26-2004, 21:22
    CVStroker
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Snake Plissken
    I believe you, and try and argue this with him on an almost daily basis....so, do you believe I should in fact be getting bass that should carry outside the vehicle with 15s?

    What are these SUVs that are tooling around with bass so heavy you can feel it from walking on the street when they pass rolling with if I cant get my TWO 15s to be heard from outside my midsize coupe? What in God's name do they have in there?


    One, a lot of them probably use more power. Those SUVs have much bigger electrical systems, so it's a lot easier to add a larger amp.

    Plus, the large internal volume of an SUV kind of acts as a megaphone. It "amplifies" the bass. Plus a lot of those kids turn on the bass boost, and max the gains, and play Bass Mekanik all the time. All you hear in those vehicles is bass, no high end at all.

    If you port your subs, tuned to about 30-32 hz, and open up the rear deck, you'll notice a huge difference in the bass.

    The best way to show him that ported boxes are louder is to build one and make him listen to it.
  • 05-26-2004, 21:36
    Snake Plissken
    Also, Let Me Add......
    My system is set up as follows, per my request to my friend that I wanted maximum power output of my amplifier to my two subs:

    My friend wired my two Rockford Fosgate Punch XLC 15" subs in PARALLEL (after complaining to him that STEREO mode of the amp didnt sound loud enough for me), and did so this way: he ran speaker wires from each terminal coming out of the sub box (this was a pre-fabbed box I bought off the shelf, ready to install), then tied together the positive (+) leads of those wires together, and the negative leads (-) of those wires together, then fed those combined channels into one positive terminal of the amp (the combined positive leads from the box) and one negative terminal of the amp (the combined negative leads from the box).....he then told me the amp was now BRIDGED and in mono mode, running full power into these two subs....

    Then my question becomes, is my Rockford Punch 800.2 amp putting out 800 watts in this mode? Is there any way to tell? And is this set up right for getting maximum power to two subs from one amp? The specs of this amp I believe say that the thing should be putting out 800 watts in one channel mono mode....can this be? If that is so, shouldnt these XLC subs be heard outside of the vehicle with THAT much power going through them, in theory? And if there are 800 watts available, how is that shared between two subs.....are they getting 400 watts each or so? Would this be right, or no?
  • 05-26-2004, 21:39
    Snake Plissken
    "If you port your subs, tuned to about 30-32 hz, and open up the rear deck, you'll notice a huge difference in the bass."

    But what if I didnt want to alter anything regarding the rear deck or seats, etc....would the ported box STILL make a difference in what is getting into the cabin with seats up, sealed trunk, etc?
  • 05-26-2004, 21:54
    CVStroker
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Snake Plissken
    My system is set up as follows, per my request to my friend that I wanted maximum power output of my amplifier to my two subs:

    My friend wired my two Rockford Fosgate Punch XLC 15" subs in PARALLEL (after complaining to him that STEREO mode of the amp didnt sound loud enough for me), and did so this way: he ran speaker wires from each terminal coming out of the sub box (this was a pre-fabbed box I bought off the shelf, ready to install), then tied together the positive (+) leads of those wires together, and the negative leads (-) of those wires together, then fed those combined channels into one positive terminal of the amp (the combined positive leads from the box) and one negative terminal of the amp (the combined negative leads from the box).....he then told me the amp was now BRIDGED and in mono mode, running full power into these two subs....

    Then my question becomes, is my Rockford Punch 800.2 amp putting out 800 watts in this mode? Is there any way to tell? And is this set up right for getting maximum power to two subs from one amp? The specs of this amp I believe say that the thing should be putting out 800 watts in one channel mono mode....can this be? If that is so, shouldnt these XLC subs be heard outside of the vehicle with THAT much power going through them, in theory? And if there are 800 watts available, how is that shared between two subs.....are they getting 400 watts each or so? Would this be right, or no?

    Methinks your friend is a moron. Thats not how you bridge an amp. Look at the speaker terminals of your amp. You should see 2 + and 2 - symbols, and then you should see something that says which ones to use when bridging the amp. I don't know if what your friend is actually bridging the amp, but I have a feeling it's not good for the amp. When the amp is bridged, you should have 1 pair of wires coming from it, not 2 tied together.

    Wire the positives of the subs to the positive lead from the amp, and the negatives to the negative lead of the amp. Unless you have the 8 ohm versions of those subs, you'll be dropping your ohm load below the stable ohm load of the amp. Look at the manual for your amp, it should show you how to bridge the amp correctly, I gurante it wont be like your friend has it bridged. I think with the way your friend has it wired in stereo, the channels are fighting each other. Bridge it properly, and you'll notice a huge difference.
  • 05-26-2004, 21:58
    CVStroker
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Snake Plissken
    "If you port your subs, tuned to about 30-32 hz, and open up the rear deck, you'll notice a huge difference in the bass."

    But what if I didnt want to alter anything regarding the rear deck or seats, etc....would the ported box STILL make a difference in what is getting into the cabin with seats up, sealed trunk, etc?


    Try wiring the subs correctly first, maybe the out put will increas to where you want it. Then try porting them, that will also increase output. If it's still not enough, you need to with upgrade your subs, or open up the rear deck.
  • 05-27-2004, 03:38
    Snake Plissken
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by CVStroker
    Methinks your friend is a moron. Thats not how you bridge an amp. Look at the speaker terminals of your amp. You should see 2 + and 2 - symbols, and then you should see something that says which ones to use when bridging the amp. I don't know if what your friend is actually bridging the amp, but I have a feeling it's not good for the amp. When the amp is bridged, you should have 1 pair of wires coming from it, not 2 tied together.

    Wire the positives of the subs to the positive lead from the amp, and the negatives to the negative lead of the amp. Unless you have the 8 ohm versions of those subs, you'll be dropping your ohm load below the stable ohm load of the amp. Look at the manual for your amp, it should show you how to bridge the amp correctly, I gurante it wont be like your friend has it bridged. I think with the way your friend has it wired in stereo, the channels are fighting each other. Bridge it properly, and you'll notice a huge difference.

    Perhaps I described how he had the setup done improperly....how YOU describe the bridging proces, with the positives COMING FROM THE BOX going into the amp's positive terminal and negatives doing the same, IS the way he has it done.....I think I may have described how he did it incorrectly or unclearly....

    Now, what he did do, as I tried to describe, is he TIED TOGETHER the POSITIVE leads coming from each side of the sub box (the positive speaker wires coming from each terminal on the box) and TIED TOGETHER the NEGATIVE leads coming from each side of the box, then TOOK THOSE INDIVIDUALLY and plugged the COMBINED positive wires into the + terminal of the amp and the COMBINED negatives into the - terminal of the amp.....he claims this is running the subs IN PARALLEL and then bridging the amp....is this STILL not correct?
  • 05-27-2004, 03:39
    Snake Plissken
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by CVStroker
    Try wiring the subs correctly first, maybe the out put will increas to where you want it. Then try porting them, that will also increase output. If it's still not enough, you need to with upgrade your subs, or open up the rear deck.

    Yes.....I suspected upgrading the subs would be next.....I mean, the XLCs are not Rockford's best and never were.....
  • 05-27-2004, 09:15
    CVStroker
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Snake Plissken
    Perhaps I described how he had the setup done improperly....how YOU describe the bridging proces, with the positives COMING FROM THE BOX going into the amp's positive terminal and negatives doing the same, IS the way he has it done.....I think I may have described how he did it incorrectly or unclearly....

    Now, what he did do, as I tried to describe, is he TIED TOGETHER the POSITIVE leads coming from each side of the sub box (the positive speaker wires coming from each terminal on the box) and TIED TOGETHER the NEGATIVE leads coming from each side of the box, then TOOK THOSE INDIVIDUALLY and plugged the COMBINED positive wires into the + terminal of the amp and the COMBINED negatives into the - terminal of the amp.....he claims this is running the subs IN PARALLEL and then bridging the amp....is this STILL not correct?


    Yes, that is how to wire them correctly, but you have to make sure you have to 8 ohm version of those subs, otherwise your not running your amp in a stable ohm load. That pre-fab box is hurting your output more than you think as well. Those subs probably prefer a ported box, and it's also way too small for a sealed box.
  • 05-27-2004, 12:51
    mike patton
    Snake, let me make one thing clear: people who make blanket statement such as "15s are no good, you should get 12s, they will carry the bass farther..." DON'T KNOW ****. It would be wise for you to run ANY advice you get from your installer past people on the forum, by the sound of it.
  • 05-27-2004, 19:23
    Snake Plissken
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by CVStroker
    Yes, that is how to wire them correctly, but you have to make sure you have to 8 ohm version of those subs, otherwise your not running your amp in a stable ohm load. That pre-fab box is hurting your output more than you think as well. Those subs probably prefer a ported box, and it's also way too small for a sealed box.

    Okay....whew....at least Im in the right direction here.....now, I will check on the impedance of those subs, but aside from the fact that the ohm load may be too low for this amp (which I dont see as possible as the amp has NEVER shut down on me nor fed any distortion to the subs no matter how high I got the volume), I am concerned with your statements regarding the box....from ALL the reviews I have read online regarding the Punch XLC subs, I have noticed it is always said that recommended for these speakers a small sealed enclosure....
  • 05-27-2004, 19:26
    Snake Plissken
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by mike patton
    Snake, let me make one thing clear: people who make blanket statement such as "15s are no good, you should get 12s, they will carry the bass farther..." DON'T KNOW ****. It would be wise for you to run ANY advice you get from your installer past people on the forum, by the sound of it.

    I think what he was actually getting at Mike was that he feels 15s will give a much "sloppier" bass, which is true, as opposed to 12s that will mix a throbbing punch with a good rolloff carry for outside-the-car bass; I gotta tell you, I had a Kicker SS-12 enclosure in an old system which was in a 1991 Nissan 240SX, powered by TWO Coustic amps, one running in bridged mode feeding one sub in the Kicker box, and the other bridged feeding the other sub....this thing ROOOOOCKED.....I was setting off car alarms, people got dizzy inside the car....these 15s, I gotta be honest, dont do that.....it DOES in fact seem like its a messy, dirty, obnoxious bass from these Rockford 15s, and on top of that, the bass isnt getting into the street........
  • 05-27-2004, 19:38
    CVStroker
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Snake Plissken
    I think what he was actually getting at Mike was that he feels 15s will give a much "sloppier" bass, which is true, as opposed to 12s that will mix a throbbing punch with a good rolloff carry for outside-the-car bass; I gotta tell you, I had a Kicker SS-12 enclosure in an old system which was in a 1991 Nissan 240SX, powered by TWO Coustic amps, one running in bridged mode feeding one sub in the Kicker box, and the other bridged feeding the other sub....this thing ROOOOOCKED.....I was setting off car alarms, people got dizzy inside the car....these 15s, I gotta be honest, dont do that.....it DOES in fact seem like its a messy, dirty, obnoxious bass from these Rockford 15s, and on top of that, the bass isnt getting into the street........


    It's all in install, and, right now, with that pre-fab box, your install sucks. If you build a box to specs of that amp, you'll have the bass you want.
  • 05-27-2004, 20:34
    Snake Plissken
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by CVStroker
    It's all in install, and, right now, with that pre-fab box, your install sucks. If you build a box to specs of that amp, you'll have the bass you want.

    You may feel that the install "sucks," but the box was built --- as assured to be by the shop (and I saw the paperwork order slip) --- to Rockford's specifications for the XLCs...now, dont get the wrong impression here, the bass does ROMP----everything shakes to death inside the car, but the bass is in fact sloppy and boomy and does not, for some reason, carry out of the vehicle --- are you telling me that 15's DO NOT give a somewhat boomier, sloppier bass than smaller drivers? You do believe that?
  • 05-27-2004, 20:41
    CVStroker
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Snake Plissken
    You may feel that the install "sucks," but the box was built --- as assured to be by the shop (and I saw the paperwork order slip) --- to Rockford's specifications for the XLCs...now, dont get the wrong impression here, the bass does ROMP----everything shakes to death inside the car, but the bass is in fact sloppy and boomy and does not, for some reason, carry out of the vehicle --- are you telling me that 15's DO NOT give a somewhat boomier, sloppier bass than smaller drivers? You do believe that?


    I believe that a 15, or even a good 18 can sound as good as a 10 or a 12, especially is the XBL^2 motor is being used. The problem with most sloppy sounding 15s and 18s is they use the motor designed for the 12. If you have a woofer that's designed from the ground up as a 18" woofer, it will sound good.
  • 05-28-2004, 04:17
    mike patton
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by Snake Plissken
    are you telling me that 15's DO NOT give a somewhat boomier, sloppier bass than smaller drivers? You do believe that?

    I believe that, and I have proof inside my car. I have a 15" sub right now that sounds way tighter, faster, and punchier than all of the 12s I've owned previously. If your sub does not sound very good, don't blame the size of the sub. Blame the sub itself. In other words, if you have a shitty 15, that does not automatically make all 15s shitty. Get it?
  • 06-21-2019, 04:23
    gustavo61991
    i had the same problem your just out of tune keep the sealed enclosure. on your head unit put all settings to 0 or flat and start with the mid 500 put it to negative one or two or until the voice sounds more clear (where the voice does not sound like its screaming at you even if you have the volume high. then lower bass on the 60-250 lower one nob down then go to your treble and raise until it sounds louder and clear and once you got that down turn up the bass and let me know if there is a difference if not then just turn down the setting on the bass boost on the amp if you have it on your amp and if not just lower the main level gain on the amp your just putting to much power somewhere and its not letting the music sound how it supposed to. or if your head unit has an option to choose what size speaker like mine says normal narrow middle wide change those settings before anything and see if that makes a difference. that's what fixed my problem. when I play with the equalizer I try to get the sound to have a rumble or thunder kind of sound (I use the mid and treb for that and that makes the sound wave hit a lot more cleaner and people will turn trust me on that
  • 07-09-2019, 00:28
    Karucal
    And I like it when the bass is heard outside.
  • 07-09-2019, 00:29
    Karucal
    Or you can arrange a small street disco, it's fun.
  • 08-06-2019, 04:20
    Kamgauff
    What Does It Take
    id say I know which subs your talking about they would only take 3-400 rms power so you would be best to go for something like a monoblockare the subs dual voice coils and what ohm are they etc cause as said before post up the model number and it will be easier to tell you what you need
  • 08-12-2019, 08:23
    Kamgauff
    What Does It Take
    I too just recently did some writingqa com research on the best wax I found theres a lot of differing opinions out there Having used Meguiars many times in the past, I decided to spend a little bit more and go with the NXT It was very easy to put on and take off and the shine is great Well see how it holds up in the Iowa winter though